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In Aid of Forever Searching

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Catkins on Sun Jun 13, 2010 1:58 am

jackf wrote:
ModNrodder wrote:I wouldn't hold them responsible for comments in a guestbook, The comment itself is rediculous and childish, so shoots iteself down

Anyway I'm not concerned with pro or anti issues relating to FS. I am sure that all organisations have people with different views within them. But individual views are not the agenda of charities such as Forever Searching when promoting the plight of missing children is the priority everything else gets put into perspective.

Fair enough, but anyone looking at a site for missing children can click on that link and be taken to a place where Madeleine's parents are accused of all sorts of things. People directed there who previously will have had no idea what has been said and who will believe what they read. Forever Searching are responsible for what is on their site and could remove a post if they chose to, I still find it very disappointing that they have chosen to leave it there. The ones who run FS know the nastiness that has been headed towards Kate and Gerry and have gone down in my estimation in allowing that link to stay there. It may not affect ones of us who know what is true and what isn't but someone who has just come into this because they have a missing child or is looking at missing children and sees that on a charity page would not know it was ridiculous and childish and can be very much influenced. Just my opinion of course, but it doesn't sit well with me.

Have to say it surprised me too.............
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Guest on Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:26 am

It just isn't possible to keep away from playing games with a big stirring spoon and deliberate derailing is it?.

Especially on such a positive thread.

So I'll say adios with this as it is a waste of time dwelling on sites where I am not welcome.

And outside the wall!!



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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Cath on Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:03 pm

Oh dear.... tempers..

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by jackf on Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:26 am

There was nothing aimed at anyone on here when I commented on that post on FS and I am sorry that it has been taken personally, there really was no intention of causing anyone here any problems.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by AlexG on Mon Jun 14, 2010 1:50 pm

I just want for the rest of the members of J4 to be aware that I agree with Mod point of view regarding Forever Searching. I want to further state that it's not the responsibility of Mod or any other supporter of Forever Searching to deal with the content posted on the guest book.

Forever Searching is an association that I truly care about and I truly have a great affinity with, because they have helped me allot, I know how they work, how they help, what they do, because I've unfortunately used their help once, and as such I'm grateful to them for all my life.

Personal issues apart, Forever Searching is a team that deals with a huge amount of missing children cases, and they are not "Madeleine specific" support group, like J4, so I think it's reasonable to have a comment like that on the guestbook, that isn't even offensive to the Mccanns in any way, it just links to a thread on an "anti" site.
Even so if someone have issues with that they can try to contact Forever Searching and ask directly for the comment to be removed, I think that there is no need to make this more than it is.
Let's also not forget that people who join Forever Searching might do so for reasons that doesn't relate to the McCanns, most of people who will join Forever Searching will do it for reasons that doesn't relate to the McCanns really, so there are lot's pf people there with different views on the Madeleine case, and as long as it's not offensive or libelous and as long as it doesn't cause harm to others, I guess that anyone is entitled to his own point of view.
People who goes to Forever Searching because they have a missing child will not get affected by comments about Madeleine because the priority will be their missing child and not Madeleine. Even if they are influenced it's their problem, they can be influenced anyhow if the Madeline case is brought to them on another way, it's not that the anti-sites will go away just because one removes a link on Forever Searching.

I'm sorry and I hope that people here at J4 don't get me wrong, but I'm on the side of Mod (now Guest) on this particular issue because I know that he have done all the best he could to bring awareness to Forever Searching and by doing that he have manage to raise funds to help not only Madeleine but also many more children. And of course Mod is not responsible at all for the content of the Guest Book.

Just want you to know, Mod, if you are still reading around, that I'm truly grateful to the help and support that you are actively given to Forever Searching and to missing children, keep up with the good work and be strong. At the end of the day what is important is what you have trully done what you have truly done and accomplish and how many people (in this case missing children) you have manage to help (for real) and not what others might think of you.

Best regards,
Alexandre.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Cath on Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:51 pm

Deuce stop flouncing on every occasion and get back in here.
People just won't always agree with you. Stop taking it personal.
If I can do it, so can you.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Catkins on Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:38 pm

@ Alex......... Jackf was making a reference to the link to the disgusting MM site being left on a comment ...not to criticise what FS do.......

As usual with Mod/Deuce he makes it about him...which IT IS NOT !!
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by bluj1515 on Wed Jun 16, 2010 3:14 am

It's offensive for a organization that supports missing children to talk out of both sides of their mouth regarding the McCann case. They cannot call Madeleine McCann a missing child in one breath and allow such a comment linking to a website that is devoted to the idea that Madeleine is NOT a missing child. A website that is devoted to the idea that she is a dead child who was killed at the hands of her parents. It would take six seconds for Forever Searching to delete the offending post. They may have done it already. But I am sure that is not the kind of post that they would allow if they were aware of it. Such speculation can be turned on any and ALL missing children and their parents and often is to damaging results. Forever Searching would be more aware of the kinds of emotional damage such speculation does to families than most others.

This is not about pro/anti. It is about the continued spread of false and damaging information about MISSING MADELEINE MCCANN. If Forever Searching finds it such a distraction, and they have not claimed they do, then they should remove her from their rolls entirely and let the McCanns handle the publicity.

It is UNSEEMLY for any missing children's organization to allow speculation that a reported missing child is NOT actually missing.

This should be neither controversial nor difficult to understand.

Being an "anti" means that you do not believe Madeleine McCann is a missing child. This is damaging to missing Madeleine McCann because she really is missing. Ergo an organization devoted to missing children should better monitor its communications and Facebook is a communication to ensure that such speculation about missing children and their families is not allow. That is not too much to ask.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by maria on Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:43 am

Agree, Bluj.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Rosie on Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:58 am

I don't think that jackf was being critical of Mod, she is entitled to her opinion, why couldn't it just be discussed without resorting to these kind of stomping off? It is getting so tiresome and childish.

I hope you are not inferring that the people of this forum are dull and ignorant with that post, this sanctimonious cryptic nonsense is getting beyond a joke.

That site is a particularly despicable and filthy site full of accusations and death wishes towards two innocent parents searching for their child, there is no doubt in my mind it should have been removed. Someone in a very vulnerable state could have innocently clicked on that link and be left with the feeling that perhaps this is what people thought of them too, the damage sites like that can do is immense. Instead of flouncing off and acting like no one else is allowed to have opinions why didn't you just say you would take it up with the admin of that site? You obviously have contact with them, that would have pleased everyone and pro and anti does not come into it.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Catkins on Wed Jun 16, 2010 7:50 am

Good grief....he's at it on Chaos now...........
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Tinkerbell43 on Wed Jun 16, 2010 8:21 am

Head and brick wall Cat , ignore, this thread is in the public domain so people can clearly see the debate, or lack of, that took place and nobody imo was dissing the work FS do.

The jibe at J4 Admin didn't go un-noticed either.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Rosie on Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:04 am

No it didn't Tinks and that really takes the biscuit after the last few weeks and the derailing of an extremely important and much needed project was absolutely heartbreaking, where did Madeleine and her parents come in all of that?

This is why we left the thread up, we normally would have locked it and then moved it, but not this time, we are not taking this any longer. We run a very laid back forum here and moderate on a hands off approach, only editing when absolutely necessary.
There was no attacking FS and nothing at all was said about the forum, yet somehow that is disgusting? How come?

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Rosie on Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:40 am

"Bridge building" and Common ground"?

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Mulleena on Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:52 am

Its time someone stopped playing the victim card its dog eared and worn out now imo!!

Get your priorities in order and stop being a martyr to the causes you profess to support, its not about you and how you are made to feel a victim.
None of us are here because we want acknowledgement for what we do we are here because we see a great injustice against a family and their missing child.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by bluj1515 on Wed Jun 16, 2010 1:03 pm

There is absolutely no moral equivalency between pros and antis. None. There is no morals for the antis. Period. You either believe not only that Madeleine McCann is a dead child but that her parents deserve to be stalked and perused like animals for that, without any evidence, or you believe that Madeleine is missing. She might be dead, but no one knows. Therefore, she is missing. Period, end story, those are the two sides. If you think there's moral equivalency between supporting the stalking grieving parents, appointing yourself judge jury and executioner, and hoping that they have a nervous breakdown, and fighting back again that, well, you're a twisted individual.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by AlexG on Wed Jun 16, 2010 1:29 pm

Forever Searching contact (just in case someone wants to ask them to remove the GuestBook comment and explain them why they should do so) :

http://www.foreversearching.com/contact_us.php


And again, Deuce, thank you for your contribution to Forever Searching .
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by vee8 on Wed Jun 16, 2010 4:56 pm

I am worried about commenting on this subject, as I have many friends on here, and I would hate to upset anyone. But Mod is also my friend, so I feel I must now speak. This thread was meant to be a positive one, about a good and decent charity and the work they do. Mod felt it wasn't his place to put them in a position where they were dragged into a Pro Vs anti bunfight, because he felt they shouldn't be involved. Forever searching is involved with ALL missing kids, not just Madeleine. He himself, naturaly IS involved in the fight for justice for Madeleine, and is a staunch supporter of the McCanns, and always will be, but he knows it is unfair and unreasonable to expect others from outside to be forced to take sides. JackF raised a valid point, but as Mod said, JackF could have raised it with FS personally. I can tell you Mod has no issues with JackF. I should also point out that when I tried to click on that link to MM it came up as page no longer available, so it seems that page is now either gone or hidden, so it is all a moot point anyway. BluJ and Catkins, you are good forum buddies, and I respect you both, but I feel you have allowed past personal differences with Mod to colour your perspective of THIS incident, and I have to say, in my honest opinion, I feel you were using this as an opportunity to get at Mod. I don't wish to upset you mind, that is just the way I see it, from the outside looking in.

About derailing that important project, Mod was proud to have been a part of it, and I can tell you he agonised long and hard about what to do about what he saw was a ligitimate concern. He knew there were several diferent possible outcomes. He HAD hoped it would be discussed, and resolved, to everyones satisfaction, but he also knew what the worst outcome would be, and it is to his great regret that that is what happened. He is very hurt and disapointed that everyone thinks he has set out to deliberatly derail anything that could benefit the McCanns, and just like anyone else, he has feelings. Mod is the most humble and self-effacing person you could wish to meet in real life, despite what may come across in his postings. It is not, and never was, all about him. But he does react sometimes, and he was deeply stung even further last night, hense the post on raptors, (Which I haven't read yet.) He called me on the phone last night, clearly distressed, and told me what he had done, and I admit I inwardly groaned, because I knew it would probably make things worse, but it was too late. All I could do was council him to be carefull what he said in future, but he needed to let it all out, and thats what happened. He IS only human, after all.

Mod has a concience, and he acts on it, sometimes to his own detriment. He asked about wether to talk to DB or not. Some said no, some said yes. At the time he thought it worthwhile, but has now since realised it was probably a mistake. He has NOT however, ever spoken to anyone else on MM, including laffin, whatever they may say on MM.

Mod is now taking part in a sponsered walk in aid of Forever Searching, and still hope his friends on here will support him. I will, and if anyone else wishes to do so I will post details up of how to do so.

I sincerely hope this post is taken in the spirit it is intended, and that I have not upset anyone, as that is truly the last thing I would want, but I wouldn't be a good friend if I continued to say nothing.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Catkins on Wed Jun 16, 2010 7:56 pm

Vee no offence taken and you are in a difficult position.

I cannot see what the fuss was about. Jackf made a comment supposedly because he/she had seen that Mod/Deuce was involved with FS - that was it !
Perhaps Jackf thought Deuce had some say in FS and was merely pointing it out. I did not seen anything offensive about him/her doing that...Some of us agreed that the post shouldn't have been left on the FS comments place as it had a link to a nasty anti McCann Forum.... that was it. No big deal....
Sorry to say it was Deuce who then turned it into a row.

Deuce has disliked me from when he flounced on PFA.....I had never really had much contact with him only to say I thought his modding skills were not good...upto that point I had never had anything to do with him.
But....since then he has taken EVERY opportunity to try and pick a fight with me....or PFA ....even to the extent of foolishly calling me racist...then he changed it to possibly racist...it was complete cobblers and he knew it.............He never apologised to me and picks on me whenever he has a chance. Well I for one won't put up with it.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Tinkerbell43 on Wed Jun 16, 2010 8:51 pm

Now I have had enough!

J4 Admin do not babysit all threads and neither should they have to.

NOBODY on J4 has disrespected FS or the work they do, I do not even know why J4 are being brought into this, but I'm sick of it.

People are airing their views on other forums about J4 Admin, so be it, maybe they also want to let people know they have raised an abuse and intend to raise a litigation against J4!

I will not be commenting any further on this subject, what is creating a bad atmosphere is people taking this thread out of context and then putting in their twopenneth and I am disappointed and upset too!

I have not attacked anyone personally and dont expect to be attacked either!


Last edited by Tinkerbell43 on Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:38 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Pedro Silva on Wed Jun 16, 2010 8:54 pm

That is why my friend Tinkerbell that this topic should be removed from J4.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Rosie on Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:23 pm

Vee, you know how I regard you, I have told you often enough. That said I have to inform you that J4 Admin having been forced to sit on the fence because of our position has decided to get down and speak on this occasion because the integrity of this forum has now been questioned openly by an ex member on Chaos Raptors and we are not going to stand by and say nothing while this person attempts to drag us into his "phony war".

I am not commenting on your friendship with Mod and I don't think you should bring that here into this thread it does not belong here, although I appreciate the position you find yourself in. Your friend would have been able to have his own say had he not flounced off of the forum - under his own steam - his choice - yet again!
Yes this thread was a positive thread, however you miss the point, a valid member made a post which in a democracy she is perfectly entitled to make. It is obvious when reading her thread that she did not mean or want to start off this unpleasantness. If there was any sabotage of this thread then I am afraid your friend must look to himself.

As admin, we have taken the unusual step and decided to leave this thread in situ, because we envisaged something like this happening and we feel it is important that others see the absolute banality of the posters comments which apparently caused this "hurt and outrage" and judge for themselves the futility of this ridiculous and unnecessary fuss that later followed. We are not going to be accused of "whooshing posts and threads" because we do not like the content. Once again the normally peaceful harmony of this forum has been brought into disrepute and for what reason exactly? Apparently a poster questioned why a forum which undeniably does good work, left a link to one of the nastiest hate sites in existence in forum land. It's very existence on that site seems to point to a disparity. The link is old perhaps it should have been removed however, mistakes happen things sometimes do get missed, this may have been a complete oversight and as Admin we know this only too well. Maybe it will be removed now but that is not for us to decide, that is for the admin of that site.

This forum is here because we support Kate and Gerry McCann, this is what we do, we raise awareness of the very issues that the poster raised, it is what we are in existence for. So when a poster stumbles across an objectionable link on another forum, after clicking the link that took them from here to there, she is even more entitled to raise that point, here on this forum.

Quite why the mention of the charitable work that FS does makes no sense, not one single poster either on this forum or on this thread has questioned that work, so therefore that charitable work is now being used as an excuse, to excuse this silly nonsense. Equally, could I just say, that there are many people on this forum who give up their time etc for charitable purposes covering a whole plethora of events, however they do not feel the need to keep mentioning this.

There was NO "pro vs anti bun-fight", look back over this thread and see for yourself. A comment was raised about a link, that comment was taken completely out of context - to inform a forum that equates itself with work in the field of missing children, that it is harbouring a link to one of the nastiest sites on the internet that actually denies that Madeleine was abducted, and openly accuses her parents of murdering her, a forum that actually openly encourages people to physically attack the parents and take aim and get them in his sights and shoot, or firebomb their home, to mention onhere that the link should be removed is NOT a "pro vs anti bun-fight" it is common sense. No one was seeking to drag that forum anywhere, that is just being used as excuse!

This whole problem between Mod and others stems way back to when he was a moderator on PFA, let's be absolutely honest about it, and that problem has nothing whatsoever to do with this forum, yet Mod keeps bringing it up in some form or another, he seems totally incapable of letting it go. FGS it happened yonks ago FORGET IT and move on. This forum is NOT going to be dragged through the mud on other forums like Chaos raptors and no doubt all the hate sites now because of Mod and his child like tantrums, we have had enough of it.

Vee you talk about Mod and his feelings, everything it seems to revolve around Mod and his hurt feelings, what about ours? Do you think that the admin of this forum like having our peaceful little forum dragged through the mud for what exactly? We did not miss that jibe of Mod's, but then Mod is very good at jibing at people and then when he causes upset he always seems to have an excuse ready to excuse himself and actually manages to blame other people for his own poor behaviour.
We aren't going to go into details of that project for obvious reasons, but he did derail it and should we wish to discuss it, I don;t think many people would disagree, that was heartbreaking. I have noticed that Mod's concerns are always legitimate and the concerns of others are not. If he had hoped it would be discussed he would not have waited 3 weeks to discuss it and then bring it up at a point where everyone was cracking on and after he had carried out two of his infamous flounces, he would have kept quiet.

What about our feelings or don't we count? Why is it only Mod's feelings? He wants to open dialogues with certain people, he is warned repeatedly of the outcome, he decides to "ditch" his true friends regardless and then whinges about his hurt feelings when it all goes pear shaped? I would not have mentioned this "humble and self effacing person" you mentioned it, so where is he?

Do you know Vee, that this "humble and self effacing person" you mention has filed a litigation against this forum with our hosts and accused us of preventing him doing some 10K run? I have no idea what he is talking about, how could we stop him when we did not even know? Perhaps he may like to examine his conscience you say he has and ask himself why he chose once again to be spiteful and vindictive towards this forum? But hey never mind, for absolute sure he will win many accolades for this over on the hate sites - well done Mod and thanks.

Perhaps before he marches off to do something else for the greater good in future, he may like to remember the people here he is continually hurting and betraying?

Vee, as ever there is absolutely no animosity aimed at you, you are indeed a good friend, I would never doubt that, but just perhaps Mod may like to understand that he is not the only one with feelings and quite honestly some of the things he has done and said, we are having trouble actually believing he is the same Mod we all once knew and loved - where the hell did that man go? He seemed to disappear when that harpy Butler came on the scene. Would the previous Mod have set out to deliberately cause trouble for this forum, when he above all knows a little of the amount of work we do and try to do which is mainly unseen each and every day?

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Chinagirl on Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:43 pm

My own tuppenceworth. This thread should stay - and Rosie's comments above deserve a thousand accolades.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Catkins on Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:47 pm

Rosiepops wrote:Vee, you know how I regard you, I have told you often enough. That said I have to inform you that J4 Admin having been forced to sit on the fence because of our position has decided to get down and speak on this occasion because the integrity of this forum has now been questioned openly by an ex member on Chaos Raptors and we are not going to stand by and say nothing while this person attempts to drag us into his "phony war".

I am not commenting on your friendship with Mod and I don't think you should bring that here into this thread it does not belong here, although I appreciate the position you find yourself in. Your friend would have been able to have his own say had he not flounced off of the forum - under his own steam - his choice - yet again!
Yes this thread was a positive thread, however you miss the point, a valid member made a post which in a democracy she is perfectly entitled to make. It is obvious when reading her thread that she did not mean or want to start off this unpleasantness. If there was any sabotage of this thread then I am afraid your friend must look to himself.

As admin, we have taken the unusual step and decided to leave this thread in situ, because we envisaged something like this happening and we feel it is important that others see the absolute banality of the posters comments which apparently caused this "hurt and outrage" and judge for themselves the futility of this ridiculous and unnecessary fuss that later followed. We are not going to be accused of "whooshing posts and threads" because we do not like the content. Once again the normally peaceful harmony of this forum has been brought into disrepute and for what reason exactly? Apparently a poster questioned why a forum which undeniably does good work, left a link to one of the nastiest hate sites in existence in forum land. It's very existence on that site seems to point to a disparity. The link is old perhaps it should have been removed however, mistakes happen things sometimes do get missed, this may have been a complete oversight and as Admin we know this only too well. Maybe it will be removed now but that is not for us to decide, that is for the admin of that site.

This forum is here because we support Kate and Gerry McCann, this is what we do, we raise awareness of the very issues that the poster raised, it is what we are in existence for. So when a poster stumbles across an objectionable link on another forum, after clicking the link that took them from here to there, she is even more entitled to raise that point, here on this forum.

Quite why the mention of the charitable work that FS does makes no sense, not one single poster either on this forum or on this thread has questioned that work, so therefore that charitable work is now being used as an excuse, to excuse this silly nonsense. Equally, could I just say, that there are many people on this forum who give up their time etc for charitable purposes covering a whole plethora of events, however they do not feel the need to keep mentioning this.

There was NO "pro vs anti bun-fight", look back over this thread and see for yourself. A comment was raised about a link, that comment was taken completely out of context - to inform a forum that equates itself with work in the field of missing children, that it is harbouring a link to one of the nastiest sites on the internet that actually denies that Madeleine was abducted, and openly accuses her parents of murdering her, a forum that actually openly encourages people to physically attack the parents and take aim and get them in his sights and shoot, or firebomb their home, to mention onhere that the link should be removed is NOT a "pro vs anti bun-fight" it is common sense. No one was seeking to drag that forum anywhere, that is just being used as excuse!

This whole problem between Mod and others stems way back to when he was a moderator on PFA, let's be absolutely honest about it, and that problem has nothing whatsoever to do with this forum, yet Mod keeps bringing it up in some form or another, he seems totally incapable of letting it go. FGS it happened yonks ago FORGET IT and move on. This forum is NOT going to be dragged through the mud on other forums like Chaos raptors and no doubt all the hate sites now because of Mod and his child like tantrums, we have had enough of it.

Vee you talk about Mod and his feelings, everything it seems to revolve around Mod and his hurt feelings, what about ours? Do you think that the admin of this forum like having our peaceful little forum dragged through the mud for what exactly? We did not miss that jibe of Mod's, but then Mod is very good at jibing at people and then when he causes upset he always seems to have an excuse ready to excuse himself and actually manages to blame other people for his own poor behaviour.
We aren't going to go into details of that project for obvious reasons, but he did derail it and should we wish to discuss it, I don;t think many people would disagree, that was heartbreaking. I have noticed that Mod's concerns are always legitimate and the concerns of others are not. If he had hoped it would be discussed he would not have waited 3 weeks to discuss it and then bring it up at a point where everyone was cracking on and after he had carried out two of his infamous flounces, he would have kept quiet.

What about our feelings or don't we count? Why is it only Mod's feelings? He wants to open dialogues with certain people, he is warned repeatedly of the outcome, he decides to "ditch" his true friends regardless and then whinges about his hurt feelings when it all goes pear shaped? I would not have mentioned this "humble and self effacing person" you mentioned it, so where is he?

Do you know Vee, that this "humble and self effacing person" you mention has filed a litigation against this forum with our hosts and accused us of preventing him doing some 10K run? I have no idea what he is talking about, how could we stop him when we did not even know? Perhaps he may like to examine his conscience you say he has and ask himself why he chose once again to be spiteful and vindictive towards this forum? But hey never mind, for absolute sure he will win many accolades for this over on the hate sites - well done Mod and thanks.

Perhaps before he marches off to do something else for the greater good in future, he may like to remember the people here he is continually hurting and betraying?

Vee, as ever there is absolutely no animosity aimed at you, you are indeed a good friend, I would never doubt that, but just perhaps Mod may like to understand that he is not the only one with feelings and quite honestly some of the things he has done and said, we are having trouble actually believing he is the same Mod we all once knew and loved - where the hell did that man go? He seemed to disappear when that harpy Butler came on the scene. Would the previous Mod have set out to deliberately cause trouble for this forum, when he above all knows a little of the amount of work we do and try to do which is mainly unseen each and every day?

He seriously needs help.
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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

Post by Pedro Silva on Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:51 pm

Rosiepops my friend, good point.

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Re: In Aid of Forever Searching

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