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Sky News today

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Sky News today

Post by Pedro Silva on Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:18 pm

My friends, I´m very sad with this: Missing Madeleine and a reluctance to help. More anti-Madeleine´s protests in PDL, where the McCanns have launched a renewed campaign for information about their daughter´s disappearance. A billboard on the edge of the town has been daubed with paint and flyers handed to locals have been ripped up. Traders are struggling to cope with a drop in tourism, the low pound and a lingering stigma of Luz as an unsafe place to take kids. "People are driving into Luz, seeing the posters and thinking "Oh God, it´s thatplace and then driving straight out again". "We´ve done a lot to help, but what more do they expect from us?". The marketing campaign is being run by a design consultancy and aimed at the Portuguese community which, it says, was never properly questioned at the time Madeleine vanished. Bit late in the day for that. But, two years on, what would you do? The key to the mystery must lie in Luz. We need to do something about this.
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Re: Sky News today

Post by vee8 on Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:53 pm

It IS sad, but I am certain it is just a minority, egged on by thoise responsible for her abduction. The McCann's have vowed not to give up hope, and neither must we. Stay strong mate, we will get to the end.
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Re: Sky News today

Post by Pedro Silva on Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:36 am

WE WILL NEVER GIVE UP.

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Re: Sky News today

Post by sadie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:44 am

Pedro Silva wrote:My friends, I´m very sad with this: Missing Madeleine and a reluctance to help. More anti-Madeleine´s protests in PDL, where the McCanns have launched a renewed campaign for information about their daughter´s disappearance. A billboard on the edge of the town has been daubed with paint and flyers handed to locals have been ripped up. Traders are struggling to cope with a drop in tourism, the low pound and a lingering stigma of Luz as an unsafe place to take kids. "People are driving into Luz, seeing the posters and thinking "Oh God, it´s thatplace and then driving straight out again". "We´ve done a lot to help, but what more do they expect from us?". The marketing campaign is being run by a design consultancy and aimed at the Portuguese community which, it says, was never properly questioned at the time Madeleine vanished. Bit late in the day for that. But, two years on, what would you do? The key to the mystery must lie in Luz. We need to do something about this.
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Pedro, it is sad.

YET, you know, that vitreolic action will work two ways.

It will encourage some to join the mobsters, who, as Vee says, are probably to do with the abduction anyway, BUT it will also upset the more balanced individuals who have humanity. I just hope that it doesn't intimidate them from coming forward if they have any information.

There are some self centred wicked people about - and they are NOT all Portuguese, by any means.

Take heart Pedro. This 'meaness of spirit' could be the catalyst for some humanitarian to come forward - and quite honestly, I would think that most of the people who are inclined to come forward will have done so already - in the early part of this initiative. This could be counter productive for the antis.
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Re: Sky News today

Post by Tinkerbell43 on Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:16 am

Hi Pedro, dont get too despondant whichever way you look at it, it raises Madeleine's profile.

Unfortunately the people ripping down the posters are the ones bringing bad publicity upon PDL not the McCanns. IMO, people continuing to show compassion would do far more for tourism then these acts of hostility.

The first distribution of leaflets and posters may have made the news for one night just to air the latest initiative and that probably would have been the last we heard of it. It is the appalling behaviour of a few that are responsible for the bad press and no matter what anyone thinks of Kate and Gerry, this act of spite should not be taken out on an innocent little child and I really do think this will backfire on them.

And for those that say its a bit too late now to question, It is never too late to "properly question" when a childs life depends on it.

Someone in PDL knows the answer to Madeleines whereabouts, they know what they have to do and I hope for everyones sake they find the courage to do it.
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Hi Pedro

Post by Rosie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:21 am

Don't get too down about this. We are trying very hard to get something done by writing to all the relevant agencies, soon someone will have to sit up and take notice of the what is happening. Some thoughts on the poster campaign

  • It is not the fault of the McCanns that tourists are driving straight through, it is the fault of the PJ for not doing their job properly.
  • It is the fault of the Portuguese government for doing absolutely nothing to stop the attraction for paedophiles in Portugal. They had no DNA based Sex Offenders List when Madeleine was abducted and despite the enormous outrage over lax laws concerning the protection of children, the Portuguese government still have no Sex Offenders Register!
  • If the PJ had questioned local people, or those people on holiday in PDL correctly at the time of Madeleine's abduction instead of trying to pin the blame on the parents, then perhaps this would not be happening.
  • People on holiday around this time in 2007 may have seen something and the posters could persuade them that these idiots saying Madeleine was not abducted are wrong and they may be persuaded to contact the McCanns team with any information they may have felt was useless before. There may still be much to be gained from this poster campaign.
  • Someone in Praia da Luz KNOWS what happened to Madeleine and they can stop this if they come forward and tell the truth, if they do not this will continue.
  • By doing what they are doing these child abductor protectors tearing down the posters are actually creating more publicity, so why do they not just leave the posters alone?
  • One last thing, how do we know these posters are not be ripped down by the abductor/s of Madeleine McCann?

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Re: Sky News today

Post by sadie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:00 am

Good analysis, Rosie

Rosie: It is the fault of the Portuguese government for doing absolutely nothing to stop the attraction for paedophiles in Portugal. They had no DNA based Sex Offenders List when Madeleine was abducted and despite the enormous outrage over lax laws concerning the protection of children, the Portuguese government still have no Sex Offenders Register![QUOTE]

Maybe we should lobby the Portuguese saying that we will not holiday there unless they get this sorted! Such a shame; the Algarve is a lovely place.


Rosie: One last thing, how do we know these posters are not be ripped down by the abductor/s of Madeleine McCann? [QUOTE]

Exactly, spot on, Rosie. If it's not the abductors doing it, then who ever is doing it has got to be hard hearted and one of the following:


  • Paid helpers
  • Peadophiles who fear their secrets might come out if Madeleine is found
  • People who are being intimidated/blackmailed because of previous transgressions
  • Business people who fear lost revenue
  • People wanting to sell/let out their property

Cant think of any other catagories, but that lot are enough - and I think it improbable that the first and last two catagories are involved.


Last edited by sadie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:16 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Additional thoughts added)
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Re: Sky News today

Post by Rosie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:17 am

It is a lovely place, but to be honest Sadie, i would not trust going there until they cleaned their act up regarding the safety of children. they just cannot have children disappearing from their beds and beaches without a trace and no one bothering to do anything about it.

In my opinion yes the PJ were under pressure to "wrap the Madeleine investigation up" so instead of investigating it properly they opted for the easy way out by trying to blame the parents. I have never heard of anything so ridiculous as offering a 2 year sentence to Kate if she admitted guilt telling her she would be out in a year! Despite being extremely frightening and insulting, this confirmed to Kate that the people charged with looking for Madeleine, were in fact NOT looking and had not been looking for her all along! How scary is that?

Every country has their share of these perverts, but most other countries acknowledge they have a proble and try to do something about it, the Portuguese government and police are just in total denial about the severity of the situation. they just have to do something about it.

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Re: Sky News today

Post by Pedro Silva on Sat Apr 04, 2009 6:37 pm

Yes, I agree with you my friends, Vee, Rosiepops, Sadie, Tinkerbell, I agree with your posts my friends.

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Re: Sky News today

Post by maria on Sat Apr 04, 2009 7:27 pm

I believe that some of the 'attackers' have in fact an agenda on Madeleine's hunt, but I don't think paedophilia-linked people are at all involved, even the 'abductor/s' or anyone linked to him/her/them. This is a job mainly for marginals who will torn down anything, from posters to motorway directions and paint even the traffic signs. Specially if the posters are about a well known cause or person. Of course, some business people can be behind this but not in an organised way. And, I'm sorry to say this, some time ago the more vocal people around were the english-speaking people who live there or have businesses around.

No, it is not a nice practice and it does not give us much pride. And it hurts, no doubt. Specially, with all these hiennas lurking around the poor parents.
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Re: Sky News today

Post by sadie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:08 pm

Rosiepops wrote:It is a lovely place, but to be honest Sadie, i would not trust going there until they cleaned their act up regarding the safety of children. they just cannot have children disappearing from their beds and beaches without a trace and no one bothering to do anything about it.

In my opinion yes the PJ were under pressure to "wrap the Madeleine investigation up" so instead of investigating it properly they opted for the easy way out by trying to blame the parents. I have never heard of anything so ridiculous as offering a 2 year sentence to Kate if she admitted guilt telling her she would be out in a year! Despite being extremely frightening and insulting, this confirmed to Kate that the people charged with looking for Madeleine, were in fact NOT looking and had not been looking for her all along! How scary is that?

Every country has their share of these perverts, but most other countries acknowledge they have a proble and try to do something about it, the Portuguese government and police are just in total denial about the severity of the situation. they just have to do something about it.



Not totally sure I agree there Rosie! This country has hidden Paedophiles in High Government places if numerous reports on the internet, about D Notices, are to be believed. There has been a lot of talk, but apart from a very few 'underdogs' being prosecuted, not much seems to have been done about it

When you delve into the internet, there also seem to be question marks about several other well respected Western 'Democratic' countries. I wont mention them, because the twitterings could be wrong and i dont want to end up dead under a bush, and neither do I want to be the centre of a diplomatic row!

It seems to me that these 'dregs' of society, albeit rich and powerful, have managed to market themselves very successfully as 'concerned' individuals and groups, whilst going about their lives enjoying what they want, when they want, at the expence of innocent children.

Portugal does seem to have a major problem and it does need sorting - but not in isolation! How this sorting can be achieved, I have no idea, because it seems to me that these invidious people are very powerful with tentacles reaching into all sectors of public power/justice/media etc. And they often manage to wheedle their way into positions of importance in groups dealing with the problem - and then manage to manipulate the findings and actions of these groups.

You only have to look at some of the forums on the internet. If some of these are not being 'manipulated' by paedo groups, then I will eat my hat!
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Re: Sky News today

Post by sadie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:14 pm

maria wrote:I believe that some of the 'attackers' have in fact an agenda on Madeleine's hunt, but I don't think paedophilia-linked people are at all involved, even the 'abductor/s' or anyone linked to him/her/them. This is a job mainly for marginals who will torn down anything, from posters to motorway directions and paint even the traffic signs. Specially if the posters are about a well known cause or person. Of course, some business people can be behind this but not in an organised way. And, I'm sorry to say this, some time ago the more vocal people around were the english-speaking people who live there or have businesses around.

No, it is not a nice practice and it does not give us much pride. And it hurts, no doubt. Specially, with all these hiennas lurking around the poor parents.

I agree, Maria, you could be right about these vandals being the type of people who deliberately spoil everything - BUT on the 3 A's, in the early stages of the posters being put up, there were people boasting that they would tear them down. I think their posts have now been removed. SICK or DEPRAVED??..or both?
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Re: Sky News today

Post by Tinkerbell43 on Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:52 pm

Maria you said,

"And, I'm sorry to say this, some time ago the more vocal people around were the english-speaking people who live there or have businesses around".


Hi Maria, no need to be sorry, where money is concerned nothing surprises me.

Admittedly this was being boasted about on the 3A's but look at the support it got from British posters! I'm ashamed of each and everyone of them.
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Hi Sadie

Post by Rosie on Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:17 pm

I am not sure about all the talk about these D notices, if governments were that intent of hushing things up, then I don't think you would be able to find trace of them on the internet. There are so many conspiracy theories flying around that I find myself very sceptical about them and all this 'doctoring' of official documents and then there are the people that got to extraordinary lengths, to write extremely official looking documents and give them the appropriate government seals etc, they look right but they are not, they are just cleverly produced scams. I have seen a fair few of these documents since all this began, so I am suspicious. Also if we can easily get hold of these documents and knowing how vicious our press are, if they were real and this were real they would find a way of reporting them, D notice or not. I have heard the antis keep going on about D notice, they usually use it to back up something they are saying, which otherwise has no proof what-so-ever.

I think EVERY country has their share of these perverts and I would not want to unfairly accuse Portugal while totally disregarding our own problems with them, what I am saying is that where other countries are at least trying to do something about this problem, the Portuguese government just does nothing about it. This is after being the centre of a huge media furore!

Thinking about this logically, Portugal still being the centre of attention over this and with the tourist passing them over for other destinations, it would be quite easy to put in some very simple laws in place, they have had 2 years, yet have done absolutely nothing, why? Have they got something sinister to hide? Are they protecting someone high up? Are they protecting a number of people in the professions and celebrity there? Would doing something about these glaring problems bring out things they want to keep hidden?

They could have done several things immediately, which would have helped reassure people;

1...Put in a DNA Based Sex Offenders Register

2...Hold a full and open independent public inquiry into the dreadful way that the Madeleine McCann investigation was conducted.

3...Bring Goncalo Amaral in for debriefing/questioning into his conduct during this whole affair.

4...The policia judiciaria should have at least held an internal inquiry, reporting the alarming 'absence' of security surrounding the 'unofficial' briefing about the McCanns and the investigation to the Portuguese press.

5...An immediate inquiry should have been held to find the culprit who passed on highly sensitive witness information, in the form of statements, names, addresses and home and mobile telephone numbers to the journalist Felicia Cabrita and the severest action should have been taken. This is such a serious breach of confidence and witness security, that in other circumstances, actions like this could actually put the lives of witnesses and their families at severe risk!

6...For the above two points, officials MUST ascertain if any payment changed hands in exchanged for this information. I am not inferring anything here, but it is well known that Ms Cabrita and Goncalo Amaral are good friends and maybe connected in other ways, (yet to be officially confirmed).

By carrying our stringent measures like this and letting the world know that they mean business about the protection of children in Portugal, much of what is happening now could have been avoided. Yes Portugal is a beautiful country and most of the People I have no doubt are just as gutted and infuriated and frustrated with their officials as we are. this is NOT an attack on the Portuguese people, but it IS an attack on their government and their excruciatingly slow justice system and their inept police force, or certain PJ members that are busily making their whole police force look mired and in the gutter with their ineptitude and their money making off of the back of children they have failed abysmally!

Like it or not, wrong or right, this is the impression that people like me are getting of Portugal and it is for these reasons, why I would not even consider taking any child connected to me on holiday there. It comes down to simply feeling very unsafe, with NO trust in the country's police force, should anything go wrong, it is as basic as that!


Maria

I understand entirely where you are coming from and what you are saying and I believe you and this behaviour from some British people and some English speaking people, simply does not surprise me, we have our fair share of people that put money before that of a child too. I just hope the people who are doing this are caught and made an example of, no matter who they are.

If I had not read of two posters in particular actually boasting about this,maybe I would not be too hard now, but I read what I read in Luz and Claudia79 and I was absolutely disgusted. It was plain from what they wrote that both of these people actually condoned this depraved behaviour and in fact both in their own way actually threatened more of the same and one went further threatening the McCanns should they ever return to the Algarve.

It is very hard to imagine how the idiots think that doing this to the posters of a missing child can bring anything other than criticism and scorn upon PDL, and actually is tantamount to pouring oil on already troubled waters.
How did they even think that this is a good thing to do? And now they are repeating it? Are they complete idiots? Now not only are the rest of the world already upset with Portugal over this, they can now add wanton vandalism and the defilement of a missing girls image to the list? It beggars belief!

Again if the Portuguese government and the PJ stepped in immediately and caught the people doing this and punished them, this would have fizzled out by now.

I also can't help feeling that the person or people in PDL who know what happened to Madeleine, may very well be behind this campaign to yet again derail an investigation and deter anyone from coming forward with what could be vital information - we do not know, but I actually suspect this may not be that far from the truth!

In my opinion this was actually a golden opportunity for the Portuguese government and the PJ to act quickly and regain some respect, but yet again they have just done nothing and allowed a disgusting situation to get totally out of hand.

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